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You can't say the guy has seen it all, because obviously no one has seen this before. But he's been there for a lot of things, so at some level, the leadership qualities just become innate. Mike DeWine're doing these things where Mike DeWine're rolling the dice -- as a country, Mike DeWine electorate is into the notion of giving people a chance who have never done it before -- and it's not hard to see the difference.