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Kennedy: The advantage to taking them out is?McNamara: We can say to the Congress and people that we do have a plan for reducing the exposure of U.S. combat personnel.Kennedy: My only reservation about it is if the war doesn't continue to go well, it will look like we were overly optimistic.McNamara: We need a way to get out of Vietnam, and this is a way of doing it.[This conversation was taped on October 2, 1963. This tape, together with a series of conversations between McNamara and President Johnson together depict McNamara as being less pro-war than he is often charactarized as being.]

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