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Johnson: I always thought it was foolish for you to make any statements about withdrawing. I thought it was bad psychologically. But you and the President thought otherwise, and I just sat silent.McNamara: The problem is...Johnson: Then come the questions: how in the hell does McNamara think, when he's losing a war, he can pull men out of there?[This conversation was taped by President Johnson on February 25, 1964.]

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